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Subject:   Traveller-digest V1996 #213
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Traveller-digest            Friday, 5 July 1996        Volume 1996 : Number 213

(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

         1. INS Prefix calling ISS Suggestive
         2. Miscellaneous Nasty Thoughts
         3. Wave Motion WHAT?
         4. Department of Redundancy, Dept.
         5. US Politics
         6. Re: ID4
         7. Re: ID4
         8. Re: Miscellaneous thoughts
         9. Re: Things on MY monitor
        10. Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #201
        11. Scrabble Triple Word Score
        12. Jesse Helms and Scott Kalkwarf
        13. Petty Planetary Squabbles
        14. Re: Ships of the Line

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: sudet@well.com (Glenn M. Goffin)
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 00:57:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: INS Prefix calling ISS Suggestive

>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <dberry@hooked.net>

>A quick idea to throw out.. What is the proper "header" for an Imperial Navy
>ship?  USS is used for the US Navy, etc..

Didn't we just have this discussion a few months ago?  I don't think that we
had consensus, but the following stick in my mind:

INS Imperial Navy Ship
ISS Imperial Star Ship or Imperial Space Ship (i.e., any non-navy ship
registered to a member world of the Imperium); non-navy ships could also
follow the conventions of their registry worlds:  ESS Efate Star Ship; M/V
(I don't know what it means, but it looks cool); shipname Maru; etc.
IISS Imperial Interstellar Scout Service ship

- --Glenn


------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 01:51:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Miscellaneous Nasty Thoughts

Thus spake: Derek Stanley <dstanley@direct.ca>:

[previous discussion(s) of Collapse effects snipped]

> With the decline in medical technoligies, the emergence of harsh diseases 
> like the plague etc.  I'd imagine that a huge chunk of the population 
> died in the years immediatly after the collapse.  50-60% would not be 
> unlikely.

Yep, even on normally hospitable (terrestrial) worlds, people died in 
droves where the population was above the planet's ecological carrying 
capacity and/or the infrastructure didn't support them any more.  There's 
some thoroughly lurid and descriptive text in the TNE rulebook regarding 
this phenomenon.  Basically, all them keen, uppity, cosmopolitan city 
slickers became so much crow feed.
  
> > I'll design an aging table for those years.  It will have one Interval,
> > and the roll to avoid aging effects will be 13+.

[the idea of beginning 'careers' one term earlier for people DURING the 
Collapse is postulated]

That'd hardly be a fun time to roleplay, but if you're going to do a 
detailed NPC, 13 years old is a good place to start (one term earlier 
than the traditional starting age, 17).  Naturally, the list of available 
career paths would be somewhat shorter...

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 01:59:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Wave Motion WHAT?

Thus spake Charles Pratt <tminus@u.washington.edu>:

> On Wed, 3 Jul 1996, Leonard Erickson wrote:

> > "We're under attack by *what*?!?"
> >
> > "It looks like the Yamato, sir"
> >
> > "But we're in outer space!"
> 
> "Fire the Wave-motion gun!"  Which has got to be, what, a huge N-PAW
> spinal mount?

Actually, the Wave Motion gun used tachyons, which...

*BONG!*  Start again!

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------



------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 02:03:36 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Department of Redundancy, Dept.

Is it just me, or are some messages being included in the Digest twice?  
I know of at least one instance of a message being submitted (one that I 
did) only once, but showing up in at least two separate Digests.

Does Majordomo need its nose tweaked?  Has someone checked to see if it's 
hooked up to one of those old, cranky SDG transponder suites?  Does 
anyone know where I left my forward observer?

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

From: Stewart Eyres <spe@astro.keele.ac.uk>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 10:31:24 +0100
Subject: US Politics

Oi! To support others who have said the same: Get that US politics out
of here!

Stew

------------------------------

From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 96 01:33:31 PST
Subject: Re: ID4

"David C.. Broussard" <broussa@connecti.com> writes:

> Sorry to post off subject, but I would recommend seeing ID4 (assuming of
> course it is out in your area).  It is a fair example of variant TL
> combat.

I intend to see it, but I'm already wincing from what they told us in
the TV special earlier this week. 

They use *braking rockets* and then *hover* over the cities? Yeah,
right.


Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com	<--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com	<--last resort

------------------------------

From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 96 01:44:37 PST
Subject: Re: ID4

Bri <bri@teleport.com> writes:

> On Sat, 22 Jun 1996, David C.. Broussard wrote:
> 
> > Sorry to post off subject, but I would recommend seeing ID4 (assuming of
> > course it is out in your area).  It is a fair example of variant TL
> > combat.
>  No it's not. The "Alien's" goal from what I hear was total annihilation,
> they control space.. Rocks. We woulden't stand a chance in hell.

A quote from the "Special" earlier this week:

"They're the new tenants, we're the cockroaches."

In other words, I must assume that they want the planet intact.

Besides, given the howlers that they were practically *bragging* about,
it's a bit much to expect them to even *realize* you can throw rocks.

Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com	<--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com	<--last resort

------------------------------

From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 96 01:57:16 PST
Subject: Re: Miscellaneous thoughts

Joe Walsh <ransom@connect.iconnect.net> writes:

> > Seriously, its just something that all of us on the Internet take for 
> > granted, Literacy.  Remember even today there's a huge chunk of the 
> > earth's populace that are totally illiterate (and then there's the rest 
> > of us who can't spell worth shit so we may as well be illiterate 8)   ). 
> 
> Very true.  Actually, I got caught up in the same misperception when I 
> was running a BBS from 90-95.  I'd see these 11-13 year olds come on line 
> and they'd be capable of carrying on a conversation...typing and all.  So 
> when I saw reports of rampant illiteracy in American schools, I thought, 
> "Not from what I can see!"   Of course, that was just it:  what I was 
> seeing was a self-selected group of people who posted /because/ they were 
> literate.

You got lucky. I've been on systems where the barely literate kept
showing up. In *droves*. And not only were their messages almost
impossible to decipher, but they got upset if you tried to suggest
ways to make their messages more intelligible.

Of course, I've been BBSing since 81....

Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com	<--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com	<--last resort

------------------------------

From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 96 02:13:46 PST
Subject: Re: Things on MY monitor

Joe Walsh <ransom@connect.iconnect.net> writes:

> The only other item is an old Dilbert comic (1992).  Wally, Dilbert, and 
> some other guy are in the lunch room.  The other guy says, "When I 
> started programming, we didn't have any of these sissy 'icons' and 
> 'windows.'  All we had were zeros and ones -- and sometimes we didn't 
> even have ones.  I wrote an entire database program using only zeros.", 
> to which Dilbert replies, "You had zeros?  We had to use the letter 'O'."

Which brings us to my favorite computer related quote:

"What are you doing?"

"I am attempting to construct a mnemonic circuit out of stone knives
 and bearskins."


Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com	<--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com	<--last resort

------------------------------

From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Date: Fri, 05 Jul 96 02:19:52 PST
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #201

Derek Stanley <dstanley@direct.ca> writes:

> >Sure. They intercepted the transmissions. They they tried to figure out
> >what it was. "Looks like some *very* sophisticated computer code, sir".
> >And when they couldn't figure it out quickly, *some* bright lad said
> >"Let's load it into an isolated system and see what it does."
> 
> I like this idea.  I like it alot.  The only thing is it relys on human 
> input trying to "crack Dulinor's Code."

Remember, this is just how the infection *started*. You do need an
explanation of how these highly trained people made the goof. After
that the virus can handle it by itself.

A real world example:

The particular outbreak of bubonic plague that most think of when you
mention "The Black Death" got "started" when the folks beseiged in a
city (or perhaps it was the beseigers) used their catapults to throw
some dead bodies over the city wall. From there, it spread on its own
in the crowded conditions (both a beseiged city *and* the camps of the
beseigers had *appalling* sanitation back then). Once some cases turned
into pneumonic plague (you get infected when an infected person
*breathes* nearby) the seige fell apart. And the people departing
spread it all over Europe.

If nobody had had that bright idea about the catapult, it'd have been a
minor outbreak. 

Likewise if nobody had the "bright idea" of trying to figure out the
code *now*, the virus wouldn't have gotten such a rapid initial spread.


Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com	<--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com	<--last resort

------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 04:34:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Scrabble Triple Word Score

Thus spake Charles Pratt <tminus@u.washington.edu>:

> On Thu, 4 Jul 1996, Joe Walsh wrote:
> > On Thu, 4 Jul 1996, Wes Payne wrote:
> > [Wes' explanation of why literacy was lost so quickly - snipped]
> >
> > > Therefore, literacy would be much harder to maintain in the aftermath of
> > > a sudden, watershed event like the Collapse than it would have been
> > > during an interregnum such as the Long Night.
> 	      ^^^^^^^^^^^
> 	      A what??

AN halibut.  I picked him out of thousands.  I didn't like the others-- 
they were much too flat.

Oh, I'm sorry, I'll come in again...

INTERREGNUM n., pl. -REGNUMS or -REGNA [ L < inter-, between + -regnum, 
REIGN ]  1.  an interval between two successive reigns, when the country 
has no sovereign  2.  a suspension of governmental or administrative 
functions; period without the usual ruler, governor, etc.  3.  any break 
in a series or in a continuity, interval  (from Webster's New World 
Dictionary)

And I still can't do crosswords worth a damn.

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 04:38:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Jesse Helms and Scott Kalkwarf

Thus spake jlindsay@direct.ca (James Lindsay):

> On Thu, 04 Jul 1996 11:04:59 -0500, Scott L. Kalkwarf wrote:

[bizarre accusation snipped]

> For crying out loud!  Get your facts straight before opening your mouth and
> flaming someone!  I never said any of this!  I simply asked Wes Payne about
> his signature line a few days ago!  The only thing I did say was (and I
> *quote*):
> 
> > BTW, who is "Jesse Helms"?  Any relation to Uncle Jesse from Dukes of
> > Hazzard?

[more semi-flamage snipped]

You know, I'm starting to get the funny feeling that I ought to change my 
.sig.  Naw...

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 04:47:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Petty Planetary Squabbles

Thus spake Paragon369@aol.com (who?):

[previous Jesse Helms (yeah, you read that right) debate snipped]

> Look, I know Traveller is going to cover the beginning of Earth going into
> space... but do we really have to cover petty planetary squabbles too??

Right!  If it weren't for such petty planetary squabbles, we'd already 
have gone into space!

Actually, here's the real tragedy:  This list is subscribed to, read, and 
posted to, by many of the minds that have either been large influences on 
Traveller in the past, are now, and/or will continue to be in the 
future.  As such, I can't help but fear that the very game itself has 
been irrevocably tainted by the foul, malignant influence of this whole 
shameful Jesse Helms thread.  The seed has been planted, and it cannot be 
dug out.  We're going to suffer it again and again on down the line, ad 
infinitum, ad absurdum, ad nauseam, just like those darned Hiver corn 
dogs, now that it's already received such treatment.  Mark my words:  
Jesse Helms will surface in a way we least expect.  We'll be darn lucky 
if he only resurfaces as one of those vile annelids that the Hivers use 
in their "corn dogs."

I, for my part, am darn sorry to have been one of the instigating 
influences, and I wholeheartedly, and without reservation, apologize for 
my involvement.

I'm probably not going to change my .sig, though.

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

From: Wes Payne <n9548326@cc.wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 04:53:33 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Ships of the Line

Thus spake "David C.. Broussard" <broussa@connecti.com>:

> BTW:  All that follows is IIRC, I cannot find my reference book...
> 
> The term "Ship of the Line" (from Napoleonic British Naval History) was

[snip]

> 1 Ships of the Line (BBs, and CH), 2 Carriers, 3 Cruisers (CA/CL, and
> variants), 4 Escorts, 5 Auxiliaries
                          ^^^^^^^^^^^ 
> I do not include any non-combat vessel in this breakdown.  The Ships of
> the Line are supposed to for just that (the Line of the Battle), and fight

I'm probably jumping on a bandwagon here, but doesn't the term 
'auxiliary' refer to support ships such as tankers, transports, and the 
like, which are typically NON-combatants?  Or is there perhaps a separate 
term for these non-combatants (such as "Support Ships")?

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Payne, known to you as:  n9548326@cc.wwu.edu
Western Washington University -- Bellingham, WA -- The Great Northwet!  
"What is FUN?  Why is it usually colored BRIGHT PINK, and where does
 it go when JESSE HELMS comes around?" 
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1996 #213
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